Another problem, too little oil in gearbox ... after rebuilt

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Another problem, too little oil in gearbox ... after rebuilt

Post  grizzly on Thu Aug 15, 2013 4:34 pm

Today I filled up my red pig with oil, but I could not get it up to the controlscrew (on the right gearboxcover under the clutchcover).
Filled 2 liters and on the fill opening it flows over - but less oil in the gearbox. When I open the drainplug on the left bottom it flows out. But under the clutchdisks, where also the controlscrew is located is less oil inside ???
There ist an oilcooler on the bike - maybe the reason for my problems?
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Re: Another problem, too little oil in gearbox ... after rebuilt

Post  Mauser on Thu Aug 15, 2013 5:02 pm

Drain all the oil out and fill her with 1.6 litres of Oil simple as that. Don't worry about levels thats all your piggy needs... did you change the filter at the same time ?

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Re: Another problem, too little oil in gearbox ... after rebuilt

Post  grizzly on Thu Aug 15, 2013 5:14 pm

I changed the filter and also had the engine complete disassembled or "decomposed", sorry my bad English ...
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Re: Another problem, too little oil in gearbox ... after rebuilt

Post  BuRP on Thu Aug 15, 2013 8:45 pm

You did WHAT??????
Control-srew on right-side cover?? Does not exist, really it doesn't.
Drain the oil from the frame and from the engine, i.e ALL is empty.
Then fill the oil in the frame until either full or until 1.6 liter has gone in, then start it.
Let it idle for a while or ride around your block, then stop the engine and immediately check the level (in the frame, nowhere else!) by means of reading the dipstick - which you do not screw in but just push down on the threads.
That's it, nothing else.

(Edited)
This means you can never check the oil after the bike has been standing for a while, as a lot of oil in the frame will seep past the filter, pump etc into the engine. This is a dry-sump engine, you must measure the oillevel after the engine has just been switched off.
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Re: Another problem, too little oil in gearbox ... after rebuilt

Post  grizzly on Thu Aug 15, 2013 9:06 pm

This is a book from "clymer", some lines from it:

And the screw is just under the clutch cover, should I post also a picture from it?
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Re: Another problem, too little oil in gearbox ... after rebuilt

Post  Mauser on Thu Aug 15, 2013 11:19 pm

"my '99 has a crankcase oil bolt - i.e. undo it and if oil seeps out, the level in the engine is good - they call it the Crankcase Oil Check Bolt in my manual."

Me thinks you have a 650L not a 650R....BIG DIFFERENCE in bikes.....Bump

Source....

http://www.advrider.com/forums//showthread.php?t=290166

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Re: Another problem, too little oil in gearbox ... after rebuilt

Post  Mad Frosty on Thu Aug 15, 2013 11:24 pm

Is your engine air or watercooled ? Or even better , can you post a picture of your bike ?

scratch 
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Re: Another problem, too little oil in gearbox ... after rebuilt

Post  BuRP on Fri Aug 16, 2013 11:31 am

Grizz,

something's wrong - either Clymer, you or whoever, but my cock on a block that an R does not work that way, dipstick only!!!
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Re: Another problem, too little oil in gearbox ... after rebuilt

Post  grizzly on Fri Aug 16, 2013 12:29 pm

I have an XR650R, think here it is the forum therefore - isn't it?

And by the way what means "my cock on a block" BRP smile can u describe this sentence with other words Smile 
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Re: Another problem, too little oil in gearbox ... after rebuilt

Post  grizzly on Fri Aug 16, 2013 8:52 pm

So guys, today I filled up my piggy with coolant and started the engine. Let it idle for a 3 minutes about. Oil everywhere in head and gearbox. Everything's fine, don't know why they write this procedure in that "clymer" book but I'm not native English speaker, maybe I understood something wrong ...
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Re: Another problem, too little oil in gearbox ... after rebuilt

Post  Mauser on Fri Aug 16, 2013 10:07 pm

grizzly wrote:So guys, today I filled up my piggy with coolant and started the engine. Let it idle for a 3 minutes about. Oil everywhere in head and gearbox. Everything's fine, don't know why they write this procedure in that "clymer" book but I'm not native English speaker, maybe I understood something wrong ...
Put our mind at rest and show us some pictures of your bike....I still think you own a 650L

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Re: Another problem, too little oil in gearbox ... after rebuilt

Post  grizzly on Fri Aug 16, 2013 10:21 pm

Ok, here is my pig:



a supermotard but XR650R
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Re: Another problem, too little oil in gearbox ... after rebuilt

Post  Chris_w_65 on Fri Aug 16, 2013 10:39 pm

grizzly wrote:Ok, here is my pig:



a supermotard but XR650R
Is that the Euro headlight? I want one - I have the USA light and it sucks

Mine is also a motard banana 
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Re: Another problem, too little oil in gearbox ... after rebuilt

Post  Mauser on Fri Aug 16, 2013 11:22 pm

Yup Euro and rest of the world headlight.....only the yanks get the lovely little headlight....did I mention my brand new headlight came the other day ?.....even picked up a brand new stock bulb holder and rubber boot from fleababy for £8.....bargain.....
Unless you ride after dark I cannot see what's wrong with the small plastic 35w dipped beam headlight Bump

Man that's one clean piggy 10/10

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Re: Another problem, too little oil in gearbox ... after rebuilt

Post  grizzly on Sat Aug 17, 2013 4:57 am

I cannot say about the headlight, bought the bike 3 years ago as it is (it is a 2003 one). Only changed the decals.
Here You can see some more pics (the decals are from USA):
http://www.xr-forum.de/index.php/topic,14747.msg205220.html#msg205220
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Re: Another problem, too little oil in gearbox ... after rebuilt

Post  BuRP on Sat Aug 17, 2013 12:35 pm

My cock on a block would translate to something like meine schwantz auf 'ne stueck holtz unten einen ax, damit gemeint ich bin ganz und gar sicher - and I am too! There's zero level screws or indicators other than the dipstick in the oiltank (= frame) hence my advice. And, if that manual is for an R it is wrong, simple as that, it is hogwash (google this before you ask BRP smile )
This bike (indeed an R, and yes, this is the correct forum indeed) has 2 oilpumps: a gravity-fed (from the tank) pressure pump which pushes oil through the filter to the engine parts, and a so-called scavenging pump (which is always bigger in capacity as it pumps a lot of air too) which sucks the crankcase empty and fills the tank again.
So, back to square one (google pls), if there's enough oil in the tank after switching the engine off, checked by the dipstick, then all is fine.
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Re: Another problem, too little oil in gearbox ... after rebuilt

Post  grizzly on Sat Aug 17, 2013 4:11 pm

Yes I think I understood the first time also Youre phrase "with the cock on a block" BRP smile 

I today got my piggy finished, removed the inlet valve cover, there's lot of the "yellowgreen" Motul Oil I filled. But still at this ouminous control screw just under the clutch cover is no oil coming out when the bike stands flat. Maybe the reason can be cause I have 17 inch wheels front and rear as mine is a supermotard. Think the "dirt" one version has 19 inch in front (didn't verify but had the 600R before as a "dirt" one)? When I lean the bike a little to the right (20 degrees about) oil comes out of the hole. If u want, I can take a pic from this controlscrew.

The manual is a book from clymer and it is for the "R". But there's easily to find a download "shopping manual" for the 650R in the internet. In this "shopping manual" this screw isn't mentioned as long as I read in this ...

Today I made 6 kilometers and all's fine, couldn't make more because I've to go for the license plate next week. First I was afraid after first starting the engine, when I took away immediately the throttle there was a "scraping" noise but I realised it's from the skid plate, which is not the original one. It has a "stiffening" which casts on the protection plate. Maybe the previous owner changed the skid plate to an afterbuilt because the oil cooler ??? Must put some rubber maybe between coming winter listen up
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Re: Another problem, too little oil in gearbox ... after rebuilt

Post  BuRP on Sun Aug 18, 2013 7:12 am

Your 'shopping manual' is the Honda Workshop Manual, if anything the one & only Bible on this bike. You're quite correct in saying it does not mention this socalled check-screw as, like I said, it isn't there. Oh, the screw no doubt will be, but whatever its function it ain't the oillevel check.... but trust Clymer to find a new purpose for it and list it in their manual.
Go ride and forget about it, as long as there's oil in the frame/tank all will be fine Wink 
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Re: Another problem, too little oil in gearbox ... after rebuilt

Post  Chris_w_65 on Sun Aug 18, 2013 10:06 am

Here is the oil level check bolt reffered to by the OP

I am not saying it is for checking oil level but it does exist - its purpose might be to check the scavenge pump is working properly??

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Re: Another problem, too little oil in gearbox ... after rebuilt

Post  grizzly on Sun Aug 18, 2013 11:30 am

Yes, this ist it.
I'ld be interested, if anyone can turn it out (with a supermotard) and look if ther comes oil out when bike is standing in flat position. I think the oil level is about 3-4 Milimeters under that bolt at my bike when standing flat.
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Re: Another problem, too little oil in gearbox ... after rebuilt

Post  Chris_w_65 on Sun Aug 18, 2013 11:39 am

grizzly wrote:Yes, this ist it.
I'ld be interested, if anyone can turn it out (with a supermotard) and look if ther comes oil out when bike is standing in flat position. I think the oil level is about 3-4 Milimeters under that bolt at my bike when standing flat.
From what I understand... If oil comes out there when the motor is running then the scavenge pump is not working correctly - so you have no problem on your bike

I would try on my motard but from above pic I don't think I can start it right now Frustrated
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Re: Another problem, too little oil in gearbox ... after rebuilt

Post  Mauser on Sun Aug 18, 2013 12:13 pm

Am I missing something here......here is my clutch cover ?.




Don't look like anything above Frustrated

And here's the 650L cover....


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Re: Another problem, too little oil in gearbox ... after rebuilt

Post  Chris_w_65 on Sun Aug 18, 2013 12:26 pm

I see the bolt in your cover - turn it around and you will see the head and sealing washer
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Re: Another problem, too little oil in gearbox ... after rebuilt

Post  Chris_w_65 on Sun Aug 18, 2013 12:34 pm

Here are the part numbers of the bolt and sealing washer

95701-06014-00
90441-706-000

Number 27 and 28


http://www.hondaparts-direct.com/fiche_section_detail.asp?section=2691614&category=Motorcycles&make=Honda&year=2003&fveh=134983

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Re: Another problem, too little oil in gearbox ... after rebuilt

Post  Mauser on Sun Aug 18, 2013 1:37 pm

Chris_w_65 wrote:I see the bolt in your cover - turn it around and you will see the head and sealing washer
But the picture you have shown is NOT a 650R clutch cover or 650L cover....confused

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